So it seems I am fully distracted by the second world war (and pulp adventuring) again.
After finishing the Rat Patrol, I decided to paint up these Italians. It seemed a small enough force that I could reasonably get them done quickly and then I'd have some opponents for the Rat Patrol (and/or the SAS/LRDG, should I finish up THOSE jeeps and trucks!?). Maybe figure out a way to play some raid missions using the FiveCore rules...? Or maybe something else...?
I have a few tanks to finish up for these as well... but I need to pick up a bottle of paint for that so they're just waiting...
Oh, and in the meantime, I ordered MORE Italians...
The Italians
One of the above was simply re-based, I'd painted it years ago as a sample and then wasn't sure if I liked the colour and got stuck on whether to proceed with those colours or try something else... and here I am, YEARS later, and I just decided, yeah, fuck it, lets go with those colours (it's the specific Vallejo colours suggested in the Flames of War Avanti Savoia book!) I've seen illustrations that have shown Italians in everything from bright yellow to something closer to a very light tan... I have no idea for sure, so I'm going with this.
Stuff to still paint/rebase
Stuff that literally just arrived today... it's... a long story... (mostly explained in the previous post!)
I was starting to look at how this might be organized for Bolt Action (as I've resigned myself that they'll probably be used for that at some point). I have ALL THE BOOKS from first edition (well... MOST of them..) and a LOT of the books from second edition, so that was easy enough... but then I went searching for information about how stuff is organized for third edition, as I suspected it was quite different (considering they are producing all new army books for the new edition).
I did find a very handy article on the Warlord Games Community website - Bolt Action: Third Edition – Army Composition! Additionally I was able to download the army lists for Italy and France (as they're presumably not in the main book?). I have to say, I'm not loving it...
While piecing things together, I will probably be able to bullshit something together for the Italians here... Things will get more tricky for the French (unless I buy a bunch more officers)...
This is what an Italian force in Bolt Action 3rd Edition could look like:
What this would all look like:
(note in the picture above I have a Company Commander with a batman/runner and a Platoon Commander with a Batman/Runner, I realized that without the company commander I could have a force of EXACTLY 999 points, so I've deleted that option and added the runner to the Platoon command below)
ITALIANS for Bolt Action (3rd Edition)
Rifle Platoon
Platoon Commander - 1st Lieutenant - 30pts (Regular)
Runner/Batman (2) 20pts (Regular)
Infantry Section - 1 NCO and 7 men +SMG +LMG - 99pts (Regular)
Infantry Section - 1 NCO and 7 men +SMG +LMG - 99pts (Regular)
Infantry Section - 1 NCO and 7 men +LMG - 95pts (Regular)
Colonial Troops Infantry Section 1 NCO and 9 men +LMG 95pts (Inexperienced)
Forward Observer - (air force or artillery) 75pts (Regular)
Radio Operator +11pts per man (Regular)
Heavy Weapons Platoon
Platoon Commander (2nd Lieutenant) - 30pts (Regular)
Runner/Batman 10pts (Regular)
Machine Gun Team - 50pts (Regular)
Mortar Team - 30pts (Regular)
Armoured Platoon
M13/40 - Platoon Command Vehicle - 125pts (Regular)
L3/33 - 65pts (Regular)
L3/33 - 65pts (Regular)
AB41 - 100pts (Regular)
Total: 999 pts
Well that worked out nicely... I have NO IDEA if these will even remotely be playable in the new Bolt Action... but I have a force potentially worth just shy of 1000 points.
Thinking on it some more, I realized I definitely do not have ANY way of really dealing with any enemy armour... other than the M13/40... which will FOR SURE be the first target of any enemy...
THIS is why I am terrible at competitive games... I build forces that are historical or interesting to me (or just whatever miniatures i could get my hands on cheap-like, at the time). This could be an historical force... and... historically Italians did not do well against any modern force that had armour or anti-tank guns... so...
ALSO....
I have one squad of painted Bersaglieri... I COULD repaint them for service in North Africa... but I think I'll just keep them as they are and use them for Pulp Adventure games or Role-Playing Games or smaller scale skirmish games...
I like how you were shopping for a mat, and then "oops more Italians". I think Warlord and Wargames Atlantic both have plastics if you wanted even more... (and Italian platoons are deeply weird with three elements per squad, two squads per platoon)
ReplyDeleteHa-ha! Yeah... it was sort of a "i'm paying a bunch for shipping, I might as well see what else they have" and I was looking to see if there were any light Italian vehicles or armoured cars for the SAS/LRDG/Rat Patrol to blow up (or be chased by!) and they had an armoured car and two squads that were half price... so then I looked around at what other bolt action things they had and if any of that filled any holes in any forces I have... The raiders weren't so much a NEED as a nice-to-have... there were a bunch of other things that were very tempting - being half price and all - like a complete Churchill tank platoon!? (Canadians used them at Dieppe.. I have Canadians) and a bunch of even less tenuous rationalizations...
DeleteBolt Action, being very generic, does not ever take into account any of the bizarro historical organizations.
I'm not particularly bothered by the way they do it. Organization charts were, at best, wishful thinking. I know Canadian squads were in theory ten men which broke down into a Bren group of three (lance Corporal, Bren gunner, Bren No. 2/loader) and a Rifle/Assault group (I've seen it referred to as both in different places - with the Corporal leading and six riflemen) and there were tactics based around that. But I've also read in memoirs that squads RARELY went into action with more than FIVE men!? What happens to the squad tactics then!? Does the gun group become two and the assault group is just three dudes!?
What happens to more convoluted structures when the platoon has sustained 50% casualties (between deaths, injured, and illness) over a time and not had sufficient replacements...!?
What happens is that the squad is basically combat ineffective, and if necessary you move up a level to platoons using squads as maneuver elements instead of squad sections. (appreciate that in this example the elements of Canadian platoons should be called sections, but you get the idea)
DeleteI read a book last month about Cassino, and it was really interesting to see how the larger units kept getting smaller and smaller as the battles in Italy went on... they hung onto all the guns though, so you get a "platoon" that is squad sized, but has all the machine guns and other equipment of a larger element. That sounds like something that Bolt Action would love to emulate!
And the Italian platoon, aside from being weird, also was lacking in what we think of as NCOs, so what is effectively a lance corporal leads, which makes that large squad potentially even more ineffective.
DeleteGreat looking Italian troops, I think you'd be able to use both uniforms together in an Italian campaign setting. I found after a lot of panic when I sat down and went through the bolt action 3rd edition pretty much all my figures were usable, you need to take an infantry unit to then get additional squads so you probably end up with more infantry than you did in previous editions which I think is alright, good luck with your, what four bolt action armies, I've got one and a bit that's enough for me at the moment!
ReplyDeleteBest Iain
Thanks Iain.
DeleteI'm pretty sure I can field at least... seven...? Full Bolt Action forces without buying or painting a thing; Canadians, Canadian (or British) Paratroopers, Russians (SO MANY RUSSIANS), Early War Germans, French, Italians, Japanese... Not sure if I have enough for a complete Bolt Action force of each, but I also have Chindits, British Commandos, Afrika Korps, Fallschirmjagers, Late-War Germans/SS... most of those are a few of those are probabaly CLOSE.... a few I'd just need to finish painting a few things I have... others would need extras...
I went a little overboard with all the WW2 stuff about a decade ago...
With this becoming a FULL DISTRACTION, I'll probably do some stock-taking to see where I'm at with all of these over the next month or so...
Deleteehhh... or maybe it was more like FIFTEEN years ago!?
Delete